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Arkansas Lottery: Yea Or Nay
Posted by: From Arkansas in Games and Fun stuff, Just Stuff on Jul 24 2008
Arkansas is one of only eight states that still do not have a lottery. 25 of the lottery states are using the profits for education in their states. However, there is a push to put that on the November ballot so that the citizens of Arkansas can vote on the issue. According to what I read about this, the lottery is to fund college scholarships and pay teacher bonuses. It is expected to be supplemental to what funds are already earmarked for education. Personally, I think it’s about time we had something like that to bring education into the new century in Arkansas.
There is a sour note in all this. Yep. There always is, right? Border states, Missouri and Oklahoma, are having a real problem with this proposed lottery for Arkansas. Why? Because those states have been reaping the money from Arkansas citizens who went into those states to buy lottery tickets. Most of the time, they would also be spending money in the stores as well. So, the loss is going to be felt when Arkansas finally gets a lottery of it’s own. I can’t help but think that those sour grapes that are being shouted out would do better to be glad they got what they did and then find new ways to recover such losses instead of crying because Arkansas is finally getting into the game, so to speak. Curiously, Texas is silent about this from what I can see.
Of course, it will depend on what type of lottery Arkansas chooses to adopt. If it’s the Powerball as well as the lesser lottery games, those states will lose quite a bit. If not, then some people will continue to buy their tickets in the other states. Personally, I hope that Arkansas chooses Powerball as well.
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Well, I’m completely against the idea of a state lottery. Always have been. Here are my main objections:
1. It’s a tax. Yes, a lottery is nothing more than a tax, and why do we need one in Arkansas when budget surpluses are common? Why not funnel the surplus into education? Will we Arkies get a tax cut if the the lottery is put in place? Of course not.
2. It’s worse than a “normal” tax — it’s a regressive one that would hurt the Arkansans least able to afford it. Don’t laugh. We’ve got enough people in this state who are barely getting and they’re spending their rent money down at Oaklawn. Why give them something else to blow cash on in hopes of getting rich quick?
3. It’s fungible. I’m one of those people who rarely believes what my government tells me. We may, indeed, get some more money for education through a lottery, but what about the money that’s already spent on education? You’d better believe that would go straight back into the general budget if the lottery were able to generate enough to cover what we’re spending on education now plus a little extra. And, again, we’re talking about a state that regularly runs up surpluses. Of course, you and I wouldn’t see any cuts at all in taxes.
Just my two cents…
Okay, I have a few things to say there.
1) It might be a tax but only those who play the lottery pay it. I agree that the surplus should be funneled into the education of the kids in this state. But it isn’t. Lawmakers in Little Rock find that education is not a high priority with them or our schools would be graduating people who could go to MIT and Yale or Harvard. Tell me, how many of these Arkansas kids do that? The number is extremely small. I would say that most come out of ASMSA.
2)So what you are saying is that poor people are so stupid that we smart folks have to teach them the best way to spend their money so do not give them one more thing to spend it foolishly on, right? Okay, as I understand freedom, I have the right to spend my money on whatever I want, poor or not. But what you mean is that if I am so stupid as to go to the racetrack and bet, then I can’t have the lottery. Hmmm. I guess that sounds reasonable.. Uh NO! I do realize that people are against the lottery. But, do you understand how asinine YOUR argument sounds? Oh those people are poor. Don’t give them more to spend their money on foolishly. Hey, God gives us freedom to choose our path. You want to CONTROL our path. DUH!
3)It’s fungible??? (See selif comment). And for the record, I had no idea what it meant either. I suspect that was to show us your education? That’s not a normal word people use.
But on to the comment. This particular item on the ballot does not say that it will supplant the funding for education. In fact, it was set up specifically to SUPPLEMENT the education funding. So, when you make such arguments, the first thing you want to do is find out what you are talking about first. Then talk.
Okay, the state runs up surplus. And could that change now that everything is going up in price. Uh huh. In fact, it is likely. So, Arkansas has surplus. Isn’t it time to get in contact with the politicians and tell them we want more money put into EDUCATION for our children? Hmmmmm? More money earmarked for education might pay for teachers that give a crap. The teachers would be better. The curriculum could be better too. Perhaps we could actually hire better administrators too. WOW! What a concept.
I do thank you for your comments. They are actually appreciated despite what it may look like. I do like people who do not agree with me since I learn things with that too. Thanks!
I think that it’s long overdue for Arkansas to get it’s own lottery. While it’s true that government entities cannot be trusted as far as you can throw their offices, any increase in educational funding is essential. Especially since there’s so few teachers that care about more than getting their paycheck.
Between teachers that don’t give a crap and all the time and energy that has to be wasted on the no child left behind farce, there’s an awful lot of kids in Arkansas that are (barely) graduating high school with no measurable skills other than passing benchmark tests for the no child left behind farce.
as for “Ethan Nobles” points..
1. Of course there won’t be a tax cut. Lottery profits are supposed to SUPPLEMENT education funding, not replace.
2. Y’know, it’s funny, I keep hearing concerns about poor people blowing their rent and food money on lottery tickets and losing their collective shirts in the process but strangely enough, I have never seen a single documented case of that happening.
Just because somebody is poor doesn’t make them stupid. Poor people have got more than enough sense than to spend money they cannot afford on lottery tickets.
For that matter, how about all of the people that currently arrange to go across the state line to buy their lottery tickets? There’s a LOT of money that would stay in Arkansas if we had the lottery.. so much so that Missouri and Oklahoma are whining about how much money they stand to lose if Arkansas has it’s own lottery.
3. As for saying “it’s fungible”. I’ll admit that I had to look up the word and I can’t help thinking that it’s misused here.
The free dictionary defines fungible:
adj.
1. Law Returnable or negotiable in kind or by substitution, as a quantity of grain for an equal amount of the same kind of grain.
2. Interchangeable.
n.
Something that is exchangeable or substitutable. Often used in the plural.
As you can see, “fungible” has nothing to do with the situation.
Yes, the government can and probably will lie about part of how money is used, that’s something governments frequently do.
As for the budget surpluses you keep talking about, they also do not necessarily mean that a tax cut is in order. Instead a budget surplus means that programs such as education that never get enough money, should get a boost in what they’re allocated.
If the education budget allowed teachers to be paid properly, then we’d have good teachers that actually care that students get an education. (and we wouldn’t need the no child left behind farce either)
It’s sad really, educating children is perhaps one of THE most important things any generation can do and the people charged with that task don’t get paid much more than the kid asking “Would you like fries with that?”
Any society in which that is true has a real problem.
First, see my previous comments. Then, I agree with you on these things.
No child left behind. GROWL!!! I hate that thing. It’s done more damage than many other programs have done.
Yes, that little detail about those who want to buy lottery tickets will not be stopped. They just have to go across state lines to the other places who do have them and buy, spending their money in those other states thereby funding that state’s education programs instead of benefiting Arkansas kids who need it the most.
Thanks for your comments!!!
I do believe the term “fungible” does apply here and I would question the term “supplement” (as it has been sold to us). Take a look at some of the states where there has been a lottery and I do believe you’ll find that the lottery funds have replaced what was spent on, say, education, so that more money is freed up to head to the general fund.
So, the term “fungible” certainly applies as we’re talking about replacing money already budgeted for education with revenue from a lottery. Lottery backers love to claim that there will be more money for education and that’s true, to a point. There just won’t be as much as they’d have you believe.
On that topic, what happens if lottery revenues dip after you have programs that rely on that income for funding? If that money that was budgeted for education is spent somewhere else, what happens to the programs? Take a look at what happened with the lottery in Oklahoma a few years ago — lottery revenue didn’t meet projections, so some programs took it on the chin.
I’ll agree that more money needs to be spent on education, but I’m simply not convinced a lottery will pull in the revenue that has been promised by supporters. It could well end up being a source of revenue that will free up what is already being spent on education rather than a “supplemental program” that will be added to the budget. That, honestly, is my main objection — projections are all well and good, but anyone who claims that the new revenue will supplement what we are already spending is likely dealing in half-truths.
Obviously, we disagree on this issue. Strongly, in fact. But, that’s what makes a democratic society tick, isn’t it?
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By the way, I wasn’t pulling out the term “fungible” out of the air.
That’s one that economists throw around, often when discussing lotteries and why they’re a boondoggle.
Ethan Nobless last blog post..It could be the greatest election season movie of all time!
I don’t think any one said that you pulled “fungible” out of the air. It may well be a word economists throw around all the time. The problem with words like that is that most of the time Joe Average has never heard them and hasn’t got the first idea what it means. Therefore it *sounds* like gibberish, whether it is or not.
It’s all fine and dandy to use such terms when speaking to people who are familiar with them but otherwise you’re better off finding a different way to express the idea. Just like I try to avoid talking about html, javascript or c++ code, object oriented programming, ftp clients, or ssh tunnels to people not familiar with these things because they’re not going to get anything out of what I’m saying.
I do love the word “boondoggle”. It says so much about what goes on in our state.
Also, I am happy to see that you have no problem with our disagreement.
Perhaps the lottery will not bring in what the supporters believe it will but what if it does? If Powerball is included, it would be likely. But if it does not, we do not have any of that funding right now. We would be hurt by MORE money coming in? How?
Having read the issue concerning the lottery, I do know that it states that it will SUPPLEMENT rather than replace the funding. Since it is specifically earmarked for teacher bonuses and college scholarships, I doubt that it would hurt existing programs anyway. But I am sad that they are only doing that. What bothers me most is that they are not interested in funding elementary, middle and high schools. Just college scholarships. And while that is actually needed too, by the time the kid makes it to college, the damage is done. They have not learned all they need.
What is so sad is that in our particular school system, they have no need to teach many things that other systems teach. I know this because a member of our family went to ASMSA. That person was tops in their class here. There, they struggled to make it through because they had not been taught some basics in math that are typical in other systems in this state.
I cannot believe ours is the poorest in the state. I suspect that there are many more like this, in fact. Bad administration is where I would start if I were to change things. Follow that up with finding teachers that love their jobs and want to teach. Don’t get me wrong. Many here do want this but are discouraged by administrators and lack of interest from the kids who know they don’t have to hand in their homework because the principal said so.
If you are worried about half-truths, that’s what we live with in our politicians, both here in Arkansas and in the capitol. When is that ever going to change? If ours has an agenda, they will show it some day. If not, we might just get some much needed funding for our schools. It’s worth the risk, in my opinion.
I never have any problem with such debates. Debate is a good in a free and open society. It is a true pity when people take things personally and that’s a shame — you can’t have good, functioning government without people expressing their thoughts on various issues. The old “Marketplace of Ideas” that suggests that we can arrive at the truth by encouraging people to honestly express their views still holds true.
I do realize that we’re seeing terms like “earmarked” and “supplement” thrown around. They’ve used those in other states, too, but governments tend to play a shell game with the funds — move what was budgeted for education over to the general fund as much as possible.
Understand that if we had some reassurance that the lottery proceeds would be used as a true supplement to what’s already being spent, I’d be closer to saying “fine” on this issue. However, this all seems to be heading the same way it has in other states and that worries me.
I do agree that education is horrible in this state and it’s only gotten worse over the years. My brother and I each earned doctorates on the solid foundation of what we learned through our schools in Benton. My kids go to those same schools and the standards these days are generally poor. The curriculum is geared to the lowest common denominator in that they don’t want some kids feeling bad because they can’t keep up with the rest of the class. Accelerated classes have been abolished so that everyone learns at the same, slow pace.
We really do need to have a conversation in this state about education. That would include discussing the merits of things like lotteries to raise money for schools and should include an open debate on the questionable standards used in developing the curriculum.
Well, I’m rambling. Again, I do love honest debates such as this one. You and I don’t agree, but we don’t have to and that’s fine. We can both agree, at the very least, that education in Arkansas needs to be improved. If you have enough people who share that opinion and have the common goal of improving it, then we’ll see some real progress.
Actually, I suspect we agree far more than we disagree. The lottery question appears to be the one thing that’s disagreed upon. So, this debate is teaching me things about how other people feel about the lottery.
Frankly, I am certain that some of the money “earmarked” for education will find it’s way into the general fund or to other, favored status, programs. While I do believe that will happen, to a certain extent, I would be willing to risk that in an effort to get more funding into education where it is desperately needed.
There is a general “dumbing down” in America which shows up very well in our schools in Arkansas. So many things that I learned years ago in certain grades are completely missing in this school district. Simple things like geography and history are put off for years or not taught much at all.
The administrators here are more willing to have the kids learn how to take a test that, if successful, will provide more federal funding. They are so bent on that that they do not care about teaching those things so that the child would be able to take that test confidently on what he/she learned in the classroom. Couple that with certain administrators who will not enforce a teacher’s deadline on classwork and homework and you have a mess on your hands. We do.
The truth is that most school districts are so worried about federal funding that they are willing to forgo some of the most basic things to teach how to cheat on a test. This message is damaging to those children. They see the teachers and administrators as authority figures. Those authority figures lie and cheat. Therefore, it’s okay to lie and cheat, especially on tests.
Then a child goes to places like West Point and the officials there wonder how any kid could be that dishonorable. The fact is, there are many problems here. Lack of education because they won’t teach it, lack of honor because they are taught to cheat and lie. And make no mistake, they are teaching these things from a very young age. Any kid who is going to take the Benchmark tests in Arkansas are being taught how to take that test.
You know, I was born and raised in Iowa, the place where several of those tests originated. In the 50s, we were the guinea pigs for a number of those tests. We were not taught anything about how to take a test. Iowa Tests of Basic Skills, Iowa Tests of Educational Development are two of the ones I took. We were given the instructions on how to take it…took about three to five minutes, maybe. After that, we were on our own to sink or swim.
Any educational system that has to have the kids learn how to take those tests, the people behind them know that the schools are NOT teaching what they ought to be teaching. They KNOW THIS!!!
So, since that is the case, we need to get to the educators, get to the politicians that are messing with the funding of the schools and get them to see that our children need to learn much more than they are being taught to date. This dumbing down of America needs to be reversed. We need to smarten up America and do it SOON before it’s too late. I believe that it is already too late for a couple of generations. Perhaps some have made it through but the vast majority will be having to do blue collar jobs, some at minimum wages because they were not taught the basics in school.
I wonder just how many rebellious kids are that way because they were bored in school due to lack of education, or bored because things were so slow? How many kids went undiagnosed for learning disabilities?
One of our family went to the top college prep school in this state. Only 1% of the kids even qualify for that school. That person was higher than the lowest of those. That person went to that school. They struggled in school because our system did not teach some very basic things to them. There were remedial classes to take which took some of the time they could have been relaxing. They graduated through sheer determination, got hundreds of thousands of dollars in scholarships that would NOT have been available to them had they stayed here in this school district. That is so sad.
While the basic thing here is the lottery, it really is not about that. It’s about getting more funding for education in this state. Yes, we do need to get to the politicians and hold them accountable for where the funding goes. But why cut off the nose to spite the face? The fact is Arkansas may not need a lottery but it does need better education. At this time, our citizens are funding education in several states. Why not allow that money to go to OUR state.
I wanted to add one more thing here. You mentioned needing reassurance about where the funding would go and how they would handle it. I wonder how we would actually know that what they are assuring us of will actually come to pass anyway.
Would there be watchdog committees or some type of way to check them out on what they do with the money? I actually don’t know about that part. Having been so used to politicians that lie, I didn’t expect them to do anything else. How sad is that???
Ah, so many issues there, but I do believe you’ve hit the nail on the head on a couple of them. Squarely on the head, in fact.
We are suffering from the problem of the curriculum being geared toward passing benchmark tests. In my kids’ school, those are a huge deal — they spend a lot of time taking test after tests and the teachers are actually nervous about what will happen if too few children pass those tests. So, they teach the kids how to pass and a lot of time and resources are spent that way.
And, for what? A test that is supposed to reveal whether a kid lives up to some minimum standard of competence? Meanwhile, the “three Rs” are put on the back burner as what benefit is it to the school if a kid excels at them? I don’t think the teachers are a fault here — the schools put a lot of pressure on them to make sure kids pass those tests, so it’s no wonder that everything else comes up a bit short.
To make matters worse, you’ve got the whole “let’s not make anyone feel bad” environment that serves to make sure everyone learns (doesn’t learn?) at the same level. So, bright kids get bored to tears and (gasp!) might even get into trouble. At any rate, they’re not learning up to their ability — the true shame of it all.
Then there’s Ritalin. When my son was in the second grade, his teacher decided he should be in Ritalin. Turns out he was just bored. I told the principal that they weren’t going to drug my kid, and she mentioned that — if she had her way — every boy in that school would be on Ritalin. While it’s been demonstrated that Ritalin is needed in some cases, it appears schools are tossing the stuff at the kids left and right. Nothing good can come of drugging an entire generation.
I was able to keep my kid away from that stuff, so I’ve done at least one good thing as a parent. He does well enough in school, so I’m glad they’ve decided to leave him alone rather than scrap with me again. His grades are fine, so they should leave the boy alone.
I do notice that no one has suggested giving Ritalin to his little sister. Heh.
At any rate, the bulk of your points are dead on. We might not agree on lotteries, but at least I do think most people who know anything about education in Arkansas agree that some changes need to be made.
That discussion is important, and at least people are talking!
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This discussion IS important, so important that we need to have more people see this and do something about it. Talk to a congressperson, state rep. This must not continue as is because of the level of damage done and still being done.
The situation with the teachers being worried about the tests not being up to par and the fact that the tests are there in the first place are why so many parents choose to homeschool their kids. And that was great in Arkansas for years. But this state makes it harder and harder to homeschool the kids. They simply want the bodies in the seats at the public school so that they can have more funding. It is all about the funding.
Ritalin. Now there’s a subject. It does seem that teachers and educators are truly interested in drugging the kids so they do not have to deal with them, moods and all. I suspect most of the wild kids are really people who are bored, bored, bored. And why would they be bored? Oh I don’t know. How about they have to go at a snail’s pace because one kid, that should be in special classes, is not getting the idea right away. The other kids act up and, bang, let’s get out the ritalin. Nice.
More people need to be talking. This is not about Arkansas or lotteries. This is about getting our kids a REAL education instead of the farce they are throwing at the kids now. When did DUMBING DOWN AMERICA come to the U.S. anyway? And the worst part is that it’s working!!!!!
If this doesn’t bring you to cry, there is a huge problem. We should all be crying over the kids who are not being taught to their potentials. They will not be what they were born to be this way, not unless they have the drive to do this themselves. Some do. Some will sit and waller in what they don’t have, be mad at the “system” that let them down. BAH!